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hello and welcome to need to know the podcast\h
that chases down the latest news and analyzes the\h\h

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important issues in the fascinating world of uaps\h
unidentified aerial phenomena i'm ross coulthard\h\h

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from down under in australia and from los angeles\h
let's welcome my co-host and fellow denizen\h\h

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in the high strangeness world investigating the\h
phenomenon bryce zabel hey roscoe you know we're\h\h

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about to start summer here which means if i'm\h
not mistaken you're about to start winter right\h\h

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yep and that's why i sound like foghorn leghorn i\h
have a cold i have my first cold of the year well\h\h

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i'm excited actually because uh you know tomorrow\h
my wife and i are celebrating our anniversary\h\h

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oddly enough by going up to santa barbara\h
to see bob dylan play at the santa barbara\h\h

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bowl because it's a beautiful location it's\h
outdoors and you can get out and enjoy yourself\h\h

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you know did you know that bob dylan was born in\h
may of 1941 which means that he was born before\h\h

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the ufo cover-up kicked off in earnest in 1947 and\h
that's something as ross said that we're going to\h\h

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be talking about later today now the great thing\h
i like about dylan besides a lifetime of really\h\h

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compelling songs is there's always a lyric or a\h
quote for practically any occasion so you might\h\h

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say well what about disclosure well the easy\h
go-to for disclosure of uap ufo reality would\h\h

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probably be the times they are a change in but you\h
know that feels too easy it's not on his set list\h\h

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and this is his song black writer i\h
dedicate these lyrics to the people who know\h\h

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a lot about the uap issue but so far have\h
not really been forthcoming and they're\h\h

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not showing the world their work product\h
these are the lyrics black rider black rider\h\h

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you've been living too hard you've been\h
up all night having to stay on your guard\h\h

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the path that you're walking is too narrow to\h
walk every step of the way another stumbling block\h\h

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the road that you're on same road that you know\h
but it's not the same as it was a minute ago\h\h

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that i think has a lot to say about\h
where we are with disclosure right now\h\h

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hey so this week we're having a birthday or\h
at least an anniversary it's 75 years since\h\h

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the so-called summer of the sources now you\h
might think that 2022 has been momentous with\h\h

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pentagon and intelligence officials doing double\h
backflips with pike in their efforts to now admit\h\h

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that uaps ufos are real after decades of denial\h
evasion lies and yes cover-up but 1947 is arguably\h\h

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the beginning of the modern ufo era and it's\h
far huger in significance as you will hear\h\h

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now we're going to get into that into our next\h
segment but first let's catch up on the latest\h\h

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developments in this vexing issue bryce i'm\h
going to kick off with congressional hearings\h\h

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you know you can't go wrong with congressional\h
hearings we've done shows on them over and\h\h

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over and they're the gift that keep\h
on giving so please give it to us\h\h

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so it's uh it's over a month now since the first\h
of the uap hearings was held before the senate\h\h

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intelligence the house intelligence committee\h
and what a big fizzer that was and so we're\h\h

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all waiting with dated brief to see whether\h
or not there's going to be another hearing\h\h

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lou elizondo has dropped hints in a podcast in the\h
last few days that quote he will he said not to\h\h

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be surprised if another hearing is forthcoming\h
and not to be surprised if we see some quote\h\h

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familiar faces maybe we'll get a hearing and\h
maybe it'll be lou elizondo himself is deposed\h\h

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before the next uap report is tabled in the\h
congress well it's shocking to hear that lou\h\h

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elizondo was on a podcast since he's retired from\h
the podcast so many times publicly but i'm glad\h\h

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that he's still out there and he's he's laying it\h
out for us and you know what i hear on the same\h\h

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topic of course is that the january 6 committee is\h
really sucking all the air out of the room right\h\h

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now and just from a pure strategic and pr point of\h
view nobody wants to put on uap hearings and try\h\h

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to compete with that so i i wouldn't be surprised\h
if as soon as these uh january 6 hearings wrap up\h\h

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that there's some kind of announcement and what we\h
learned last time of course ross was that they can\h\h

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announce a hearing and have one right away i mean\h
they announced that uh house hearing and then i\h\h

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believe six days later they had it so it may not\h
have been the world's greatest hearing but it was\h\h

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one of the world's fastest hearings yeah what\h
i heard was that it was possibly going to be\h\h

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a subcommittee of the house senate armed services\h
committee called the emerging threats subcommittee\h\h

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and the reason that's significant is because\h
senator kirsten gillibrand is on that committee\h\h

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so she's she's the one who's been quite outspoken\h
and pushing for um uh these hearings so maybe this\h\h

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is the big opportunity for somebody who\h
actually knows what she's talking about\h\h

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to actually ask some good questions i believe\h
that uh senator gillibrand is a former prosecutor\h\h

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herself if i'm not mistaken anyway she sure\h
knows her way around asking questions we have a\h\h

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bonus video up on our youtube site where she is\h
talking to the person who's about to get the uh\h\h

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one of the top jobs in the um what was the um it\h
wasn't uh help me out here what what it's the guy\h\h

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that basically said he would get back to her\h
she was asking him questions he would get back\h\h

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i think it was the defense inspector general yes\h
the inspector general thing yes absolutely and\h\h

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he was uh he was dodging and weaving you know\h
i'll get back to you senator and she just said\h\h

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you know what why don't you get back to me\h
in writing before we vote and again you know\h\h

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we we've loved this one and uh like i say it's up\h
on our youtube his two-word answer was yes ma'am\h\h

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so she really knows how how to ask a question and\h
how to get an answer so compared to some of the\h\h

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lame uh stuff that happened in the house committee\h
if if we get a senate committee and gillibrand is\h\h

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get some time to start asking questions i say\h
that'll be some fireworks now bryce one of the\h\h

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most momentous things to happen this month is\h
nasa's announcement that it's setting up its own\h\h

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independent study into uaps and it's significant\h
because we know that the head of nasa bill nelson\h\h

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who a former senator we know that he's been\h
given the briefing he's seen the videos he\h\h

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knows what's not being revealed to the public\h
and if you recall i think back november last year\h\h

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he said in very intriguing comments about the\h
navy's tic tac sighting in 2004 who am i to say\h\h

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that planet earth is the only location of a life\h
form that is civilized and organized like ours\h\h

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so so nasa's going to do its own study this is\h
significant you think it's totally significant and\h\h

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and i think you're right about bill nelson he and\h
gillibrand and a few others uh on the hill and and\h\h

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and in washington dc are are starting to become my\h
new heroes when they speak like that because it he\h\h

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does sound like a breath of fresh air because\h
remember historically nasa has sort of said\h\h

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we don't touch ufos i mean if you go back to\h
jimmy carter when he first got elected he came in\h\h

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and he wasn't getting the cooperation he was\h
hoping for to be as forthcoming about the ufo\h\h

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issue as he told people he would be during the\h
campaign and so he actually started fishing around\h\h

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to see if nasa would take on the job and nasa\h
turned him down cold said we don't want anything\h\h

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to do with that and that has sort of been their\h
position over the years until along comes uh\h\h

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our our new administrator you know i wrote\h
down a couple of quotes from that uh press\h\h

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conference where they announced that they were\h
going to do this the first is from a guy named\h\h

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thomas zurbuchen i hope i got that name right he\h
is the associate administrator for science at nasa\h\h

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but here's what he said he said nasa believes that\h
the tools of scientific discovery are powerful and\h\h

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apply here also we have access to a broad range of\h
observations of earth from space and that is the\h\h

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lifeblood of scientific inquiry we have the tools\h
and team who can help us improve our understanding\h\h

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of the unknown that's the very definition of what\h
science is that's what we do i mean wow thank you\h\h

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one other line he actually said which i thought\h
was enormously significant was we're not scared of\h\h

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reputational risk and initially i sort of balked\h
at that and thought oh you fop you know really why\h\h

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would you be worried about reputational risk when\h
everybody's admitted that these things whatever\h\h

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the hell they are are real and then i thought\h
no it is significant because you've got a nasa\h\h

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scientific official admitting that he's not going\h
to accept the stigma associated with uaps they\h\h

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are going to engage with this scientifically now\h
can i just have a little minor gripe for a moment\h\h

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yes please do a snapper announcement you have\h
to read the fine print in the nasa announcement\h\h

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turns out it's only going to be a nine-month study\h
and they're only giving it a tiny budget of 100\h\h

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000 dollars if so it's worse than that they said\h
up to 100 000 that it might be just 10 grand\h\h

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i mean yeah you know i can't go get a used car\h
for 10 grand around here these days so if that's\h\h

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all they're going to spend on it they better be\h
borrowing a lot of data from other people so i did\h\h

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some sums i looked at the estimate estimated costs\h
currently the estimated costs of giant moon rocket\h\h

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the the nasa giant moon rocket which is called the\h
space launch system it's blown out massively in\h\h

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expenditure and it's apparently going to cost 4.1\h
billion us dollars per launch so i figure that one\h\h

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hundred thousand dollars if they spend all of it\h
would get just two kilograms of payload into low\h\h

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earth orbit it kind of puts perspective into it\h
kind of thing puts things into perspective doesn't\h\h

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it that really in the long run for an organization\h
that spends billions of dollars to suddenly turn\h\h

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around after 60 years and say you know what we are\h
taking ufos seriously we are going to investigate\h\h

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them and what's more we're going to spend up to a\h
hundred thousand dollars what it proves to me ross\h\h

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is that the stigma is still alive and it's\h
but it's it's a different spin on it so yes\h\h

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uh bill nelson wants to say we're open to it and\h
we're going to do it and that's the message that's\h\h

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that's him attempting to say look we're on the job\h
we take it seriously however they don't want to\h\h

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suffer the slings and arrows that they\h
would get if they're spending a lot of\h\h

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money because they know that there are people\h
in congress and there are also people all over\h\h

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the united states and around the world who\h
would say oh you're wasting your money we have\h\h

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and then name your problem we have this problem\h
or that problem or this problem and you guys want\h\h

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to spend money looking into ufos but i will say\h
one thing if they do start grabbing uh data from\h\h

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other places and pulling it together and analyzing\h
it with their own capabilities i mean they have a\h\h

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lot of already built in things that they can go\h
to that they don't have to build from scratch\h\h

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whereas they can pull data from them but they\h
do say that they're going to be open i did the\h\h

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other quote comes from a guy named daniel evans\h
who apparently is the official who's responsible\h\h

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for actually getting the study done and he says\h
consistent with nasa's principles of openness\h\h

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transparency and scientific integrity the report\h
will be shared publicly so that's good news he\h\h

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says all of nasa's data is available to the public\h
we take that obligation seriously and we make it\h\h

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easily accessible for anyone to see or study so\h
you know yes it's a mixed message i i can't deny\h\h

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to you that when i saw a hundred thousand dollars\h
i thought you know um that's not a lot of money\h\h

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you know the other thing that nasa announced\h
in the small print and their press release\h\h

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with that they're going to make no use of secret\h
military data so you just think about that it\h\h

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means they're not going to look at any of the nro\h
satellites there's not going to be any looking at\h\h

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any of the feeds from military satellites a lot\h
of those classified shuttle missions where we've\h\h

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seen weird objects on some of the video feeds\h
coming from the shuttle all of that i suspect\h\h

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will probably be excluded but bryce there is\h
an optimistic hope on the horizon because from\h\h

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the other side of the world comes mother russia\h
russia has announced russia has announced that it\h\h

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is going to conduct its own study into these\h
ufo reports the space agency chief dmitry rogers\h\h

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who's the head of ross cosmos the russians\h
i could listen to you read russian names\h\h

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all day long uh you know i feel like breaking\h
out into a bella like her and doing it that's

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but he said in an interview with rossia\h
the 24-hour news channel the russian cnn\h\h

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he said that 99 of all these ufo reports were\h
later identified as atmospheric and other physical\h\h

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phenomena but but he also acknowledged that quote\h
we might be a subject to some external observation\h\h

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that was a clear reference to the possibility\h
of somebody else well he also said hey we study\h\h

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bacteria i mean maybe somebody's looking at\h
us like we look at bacteria which i thought\h\h

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unless the translation is wrong that's a pretty\h
provocative thing for somebody to say and uh i\h\h

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do think and i don't have an explanation for this\h
maybe you do but it seems odd to me that in the\h\h

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same week that the united states and russia both\h
announce that their space agencies are going to\h\h

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look into ufos i mean was that just coincidence i\h
mean what what's going on it wasn't and it wasn't\h\h

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and and also just add to the bow um president\h
bill clinton former president bill clinton\h\h

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went on james corbell this week and reggie watts\h
the band leader asked a great question he said\h\h

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mr president what's your viewpoint on these\h
objects that seem to divide all laws of physics\h\h

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and the audience did what audiences do whenever\h
ufos get mentioned they did that nervous laugh\h\h

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and you know what mr clinton did he\h
looked at it i hope he said don't laugh\h\h

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no he looked at the audience and he\h
said that is a legitimate question now\h\h

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and he picked them up on it and i'm thinking\h
that was actually a that's a turning moment in\h\h

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destigmatizing this issue because you know former\h
presidents receive the us government's top secret\h\h

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intelligence briefings they know what's going on\h
that's bill that is bill clinton unleashed hey you\h\h

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know as long as we're talking about the media and\h
nasa uh do i have time to do a little pet peeve\h\h

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bit here what do you think sure can i all right\h
listen we like to keep tabs folks on the steep\h\h

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climb that the media and the science community\h
often continue to force the cause of uap honesty\h\h

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to hike up so today's contribution in my pet peeve\h
comes from the news rundown from the staff of the\h\h

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magazine called science all right their so-called\h
news at a glance lists important stories that\h\h

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happen during the week all right and they do have\h
one that is called nasa steps into the ufo hunt\h\h

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all right so far so good let me tell you what\h
comes before the nasa one there's a report about\h\h

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a dust grain that's one tenth of a millimeter\h
that hit the webb telescope but it's not a problem\h\h

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there's another one about how the u s is next\h
funding to research collaborations with russia\h\h

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then it's followed by the world health\h
organization saying don't rule out china\h\h

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labs for kovid then there's an underwater chasm\h
in the atlantic ocean being proposed but not yet\h\h

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a marine sanctuary but we're not done yet folks\h
they're still reporting about the uk having\h\h

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legislation that would force universities not to\h
take money from foreign governments hasn't passed\h\h

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yet next up two storm watching satellites had a\h
failure to launch okay still going now there's\h\h

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movement to rename monkey pox because its name\h
is discriminating and stigmatizing and it goes\h\h

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on and on if you're counting it gets to one at\h
the end that says and then one more it appears\h\h

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a troubled research facility for beagles is\h
going to close so if you're keeping count\h\h

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science put 10 different reports all of which\h
science considers more important than the fact\h\h

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that nasa after years of declining to touch the\h
ufo issue is actually going to investigate it now\h\h

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i'm still a little shocked by this ross\h
but i guess i'm no longer surprised\h\h

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you know the thing that really shocked me i think\h
in ending this segment we should acknowledge that\h\h

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the thing that i think flagged nasa's intentions\h
in this report this study that they're going to\h\h

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do is that they actually declared that there is no\h
evidence of extraterrestrial life on this planet\h\h

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so if there wasn't prejudging the conclusions that\h
they're destined to make i'd be surprised because\h\h

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it was a great disappointment i mean just this\h
week bryce i'll finish this segment because i was\h\h

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going to talk about the drones but um you know the\h
fact that drones seem to be becoming the new swamp\h\h

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gas but i'm just going to finish this segment\h
referring to an incident that happened in 1981\h\h

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i had a correspondent got in touch with\h
me who was a crewman on board the aircraft\h\h

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carrier uss eisenhower in 1981 and what he's\h
told me is shocking because he says a missile\h\h

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was potentially fired at a giant\h
black triangle hovering over the uss\h\h

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eisenhower and it's fascinating\h
because basically what he describes\h\h

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is a triangular not equal object more like a\h
giant pizza slice as big as the cruiser that was\h\h

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right next to the uss eisenhower was either\h
the uss south carolina or the uss virginia\h\h

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both nuclear-powered cruises the object\h
hovering over that cruiser had a huge\h\h

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amber light in its bottom center three lights\h
in each corner one red the others blue and green\h\h

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it was mesmerizingly beautiful much like\h
the projection tv screens of that era\h\h

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the skin of that craft was polished with\h
something an auto detailer would die for\h\h

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to say we were stunned was an understatement we\h
all there were seven of us up there at the time\h\h

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asked each other if we were seeing it too\h
we wanted to be sure we weren't going crazy\h\h

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then the ship is called to general quarters\h
and a missile is fired and bryce you know\h\h

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what the public were told and the missile was\h
i know they were there was a declaration made\h\h

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i did some research the public was told that a\h
missile was accidentally deployed off the ship\h\h

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oh big accident near puerto rico now this is why\h
i don't buy this official line from nasa or the\h\h

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pentagon that there is no evidence of something\h
there is evidence of something else and that's why\h\h

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predetermined conclusions should not be accepted\h
it will that way we're way past predetermined\h\h

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conclusions also everything keeps getting couched\h
in terms of we're going to go get the data\h\h

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we're going to get data we're going to look into\h
all the machinery we have that can give us data\h\h

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well you know what what about good witnesses\h
what about the photos what about the videos\h\h

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clearly uh we know people in congress who are\h
getting into some of those uh meetings are coming\h\h

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out quote gobsmacked well you know what i'd like\h
to be godsmacked i'd like to see the stuff that\h\h

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they're god's smacking about because i think it's\h
time for us to see that stuff and i think we need\h\h

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to go to the end of this segment and come back in\h
1947 with the summer of the sources that's next on\h\h

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need to know because we must remember our history\h
to understand our future coming up on need to know

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well we're back and we want to talk about the 1947\h
summer of the saucers you know back in 1947 the\h\h

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public narrative about flying saucers began with\h
the kenneth arnold sighting and it deepened in\h\h

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mystery two weeks later with the roswell crash\h
and that same summer saw the creation of the\h\h

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air force and the central intelligence agency and\h
then it ended with the famous twining memo i mean\h\h

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nothing has ever been the same since that time\h
it was literally uh this the biggest ufo year\h\h

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ever and because uh you know ross mentioned we're\h
doing the anniversary it is the 75th anniversary\h\h

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so uh i just put one thing out there ross for\h
us to sort of give us a little perspective uh\h\h

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according to the united nations the average human\h
lifespan and it may have gone down a little bit\h\h

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from covid but it was 73.6 years so the cover-up\h
if you will uh that started in 1947 is now\h\h

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longer than a normal human lifespan so that's\h
kind of a long time it sure is and and frankly\h\h

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if we don't remember what happened in 1947 we're\h
never going to understand the history that we have\h\h

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now because i think a lot of what i mean if you\h
accept that roswell wasn't a mogul balloon just\h\h

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a weather balloon of some kind or some kind of\h
scientific research balloon to monitor the soviets\h\h

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if you accept that it was and i think the evidence\h
is overwhelming that it was some kind of a crash\h\h

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of something that the military didn't want us to\h
know about and that that cover-up continues today\h\h

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that really was wasn't it the beginning of the\h
modern ufo era listen uh completely um just a\h\h

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little shameless plug here tomorrow i believe uh\h
the debrief uh has an article that i've written\h\h

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called summer of the saucers which is on this very\h
topic and you know one of the things uh there's a\h\h

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quote that comes from william shakespeare in the\h
tempest and he wrote what's past his prologue it's\h\h

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a great quote because oliver stone has used it i\h
believe on his movies and the irony about the what\h\h

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you know the past is what's past this prologue\h
is that it's on the national archives building\h\h

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in washington dc and the military quotes it all\h
the time about the various wars fought throughout\h\h

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history and you know what i think is interesting\h
about this is uh the past does tell us a lot about\h\h

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the future what we have uh happening around us\h
right now is an attempt to sort of gaslight us the\h\h

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two guys that spoke before the house intelligence\h
committee those guys uh were basically saying yeah\h\h

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i don't really know anything about what happened\h
before uh this stuff with the nimitz back in\h\h

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2004. don't really don't really know that so\h
i think we should school them a little bit\h\h

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but the one thing i would like to do is just\h
sort of give everybody a little bit of context\h\h

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uh 1947 does seem like a long time ago 75 years\h
ago but i want you to remember just the world as\h\h

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it was then and then we'll tell you what why uh\h
the summer the sausage was so important we were\h\h

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the only nuclear armed superpower we're the only\h
superpower coming out of world war ii the united\h\h

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states was more powerful more secure than ever\h
before in history 1947 was the year the cold war\h\h

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started when the truman doctrine came out it was\h
the origin year for the doomsday clock when uh\h\h

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the bulletin of atomic scientists decided to start\h
telling us how close we were to nuclear war europe\h\h

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was a mess the marshall plan hadn't even started\h
to clean it up it was the year that chuck yeager\h\h

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broke the sound barrier by going uh 662 miles per\h
hour and it was also on june 23rd 1947 the year\h\h

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that the town of the day that the taft-hartley act\h
was passed and people were all talking about that\h\h

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it was a reversal for the truman administration\h
well what a difference a day makes because one\h\h

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day later instead of focusing on washington d.c\h
the eyes of the nation were pivoting to what was\h\h

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going on in washington state is it fair to say\h
bryce that the america of 1947 was more trusting\h\h

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in authority back then 75 years ago well uh yes my\h
friend that is certainly the case uh we got out of\h\h

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world war ii and uh people thought well we did\h
pretty good there it was wasn't a picnic but we\h\h

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we stopped hitler and i think people were\h
feeling pretty good about it and and frankly\h\h

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they thought that the government had done the\h
right thing and and had executed pretty well\h\h

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but what happened in my lifetime certainly is\h
three events that completely eroded confidence\h\h

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in the us government um they included um the\h
kennedy admin uh assassination when jfk was killed\h\h

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and then oswald was killed two days later a lot of\h
people said that's not right you know something's\h\h

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fishy here and then along comes the vietnam war\h
where the government is lying about the body\h\h

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counts and uh people were seeing their sons dying\h
overseas for a war they didn't really understand\h\h

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and then that got followed up by watergate\h
where the president of the united states was\h\h

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openly uh attack again a sort of an attack\h
on democracy by breaking into the democratic\h\h

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headquarters and then lying about it so\h
these three events really did ross take down\h\h

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uh our our belief in uh the honesty of the\h
american government which i think if you\h\h

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uh as history books are written in the future and\h
you start to now see that there the ufo situation\h\h

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and history need to be told as one story\h
instead of one story and then a supposition\h\h

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once they kind of merge together well\h
that's going to be a powerful story\h\h

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can i offer my opinion on why that era 75 years\h
ago that year 75 years ago was so significant\h\h

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yeah i mean i think it's got\h
something to do with the fact that\h\h

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we're being told now by moultrie and bray\h
and the evidence to the congress that\h\h

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gee wow this is just a very recent discovery these\h
ufos these uaps they are real my goodness me but\h\h

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the thing that leapt out at me when i was doing\h
my research for my book was the fact that in 1947\h\h

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the military the us air force everybody was being\h
quite open about the fact that this was a mystery\h\h

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that was confounding them they were acknowledging\h
publicly that these events were happening\h\h

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there were reports from the los alamos nuclear\h
laboratories the sensitive areas and the\h\h

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nevada test range there were reports of strange\h
anomalous objects doing maneuvers over scientists\h\h

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over military officials and this was being\h
acknowledged in many cases in public uh reporting\h\h

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and i think one of the things that leapt out at\h
me was you know if airline pilots were openly\h\h

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canvassing for example that they were seeing these\h
anomalous objects it was an era where the uap the\h\h

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ufo mystery was much more openly discussed and\h
i think it shows the lie to the notion that\h\h

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today oh my goodness me the congress has\h
just acknowledged these things are real\h\h

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because 75 years ago right up until probably from\h
1947 when this first kicked off to around about\h\h

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1952 after the washington flyover the military\h
was broadly much more open than it is today a\h\h

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little bit i i i always uh i have to beg to differ\h
a little bit on that because remember 1947 in july\h\h

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is the time when uh the the military actually\h
put out a press release saying we've recovered\h\h

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a flying disc uh here in roswell and then the\h
very next day they said never mind and really\h\h

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kind of put the kibosh on that whole storyline uh\h
it's also a time where um that you know that that\h\h

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the military was writing memos we talked about the\h
twining memo maybe we'll talk about that again but\h\h

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they were writing internal memos for each for\h
themselves that were being circulated throughout\h\h

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the pentagon that were kind of open about the\h
whole thing but we didn't get a chance to see\h\h

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those memos until the freedom of information act\h
allowed them out so there were times and i'll give\h\h

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you the the point for sure in 1952 when there were\h
all the over flights over washington dc and it was\h\h

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kind of hard to ignore that this was happening\h
it is true that the military did have a big news\h\h

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conference they really couldn't do much else\h
about it where they admitted uh that they were\h\h

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uh looking into it but certain things didn't get\h
admitted like harry truman demanded after those uh\h\h

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that 1952 overflights he demanded to have uh\h
briefings every three months they didn't tell\h\h

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the the nation that he was looking into ufos in\h
fact publicly they were acting like nothing to\h\h

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see here so i i don't know i i think there's\h
truth on both sides of it they were probably\h\h

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more open in some respects than they are now but\h
but i can't give them a pass on it they the fix\h\h

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kind of came in and you know let me put that in\h
context and i'll toss it over to you um so that\h\h

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folks understand this in on june 24th the day\h
after that taft-hartley act was in the news uh\h\h

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kenneth arnold a pilot uh in in washington state\h
uh saw nine different flying saucers if you will\h\h

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that were flying across uh his his sight line and\h
he estimated that they were going at 1700 miles\h\h

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per hour and remember this is the time when i said\h
that um the sound barrier with the x1 was being\h\h

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broken at 662. so a pretty big deal and the thing\h
is flying saucers caught the world and the united\h\h

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states literally by storm in the summer of 1947\h
and it continued but then ross i got to tell you\h\h

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shortly after roswell which was and sort of\h
announced on july 8th with that press release\h\h

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sometime in july the media kind of the media so\h
i i don't know again i'm maybe i'm not talking\h\h

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about the government i am talking about the\h
media the media which had been very open in\h\h

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discussing these cases and there were many many\h
many great cases being reported suddenly the\h\h

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media took another point of view that it was all\h
about denial and ridicule and it was like saying\h\h

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yeah what can you believe about these people\h
they must all be kind of hallucinating\h\h

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they must have so do you think it was do you\h
think there was a cover-up i mean obviously\h\h

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you believe there was a cover-up with roswell\h
i i do yes i do certainly i don't know i don't\h\h

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know what they were covering up for sure but i do\h
believe there was a cover-up that's irrefutable\h\h

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but do you believe there was a cover-up that\h
went through 1947 that there was a change in\h\h

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the way the media reported this issue because it\h
was decided that they just had to shut down public\h\h

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commentary about an issue that they were now\h
investigating very aggressively behind the scenes\h\h

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well i can't argue that the media was taking\h
chapter and verse from the u.s government that\h\h

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they should treat cases with less seriousness\h
although there have been books written like\h\h

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the missing times i think is is a book that\h
does allege that the cia was involved in in\h\h

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using assets they had it in newspapers around the\h
country to sort of poo poo the whole flying saucer\h\h

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thing so that that kind of did happen and and i do\h
think the military realized they had a pretty big\h\h

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problem and they tried not to make it into a big\h
deal so yeah i think you could make an argument\h\h

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that things uh not only blew up in 1947 but then\h
they got put back in the box as successfully as\h\h

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they could uh go ahead yeah no i was cause i was\h
going to ask i was going to ask do you think it's\h\h

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possible then in this modern era that the same\h
kind of shutdown could occur again i mean we like\h\h

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to value the fact that we have an aggressive and\h
questioning media but frankly i mean as a member\h\h

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of the media myself i think that the current\h
state of world media is pretty appalling and\h\h

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the era where there was aggressive and incisive\h
investigative reporting from major mastheads\h\h

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into issues that require investigation is well and\h
truly over and frankly i worry i'm very worried\h\h

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that the kind of shutdown that occurred in 1947\h
the very clear manipulation of the media because\h\h

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i do i do think media manipulation was happening\h
at that time i'm worried it could happen again\h\h

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and frankly we're more susceptible to it now than\h
than before i take your point uh i think there\h\h

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are some differences um i i hope it doesn't\h
happen again that would certainly not serve\h\h

327
00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:38,640
the public's best interest there are a couple of\h
differences you talked about how people trusted\h\h

328
00:33:38,640 --> 00:33:45,040
the government uh back then more than they they\h
do now certainly was true about the media as well\h\h

329
00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:52,080
uh you know back in in those days the there well\h
it was an entirely different kind of media there\h\h

330
00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:57,200
were three uh television networks so if you didn't\h
get past them you didn't get your message out\h\h

331
00:33:57,200 --> 00:34:03,280
there were there was a newspaper in every city and\h
that was basically uh there were the guardians of\h\h

332
00:34:03,280 --> 00:34:08,880
that and so for ufo people like donald kehoe and\h
people like that that were studying james mcdonald\h\h

333
00:34:08,880 --> 00:34:14,640
studying the k the situation in the day\h
they had to contend with very few avenues\h\h

334
00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:19,520
to express their opinions but you look at\h
today i'm not saying it's great but it it it\h\h

335
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:26,400
is a bit messy but with the uh with twitter and\h
youtube and all the social media and the uh and\h\h

336
00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:33,360
cable and streaming and the the sheer amount of\h
content um i don't think that something this big\h\h

337
00:34:33,360 --> 00:34:39,920
that is being talked about this publicly and has\h
literally now been admitted by the government as\h\h

338
00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:45,360
being a real phenomena uh i don't think you put it\h
back in the box now that's just me i'm not trying\h\h

339
00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:50,240
to be pollyanna here i'm not trying to say oh i\h
think it's all going to be beautiful and work out\h\h

340
00:34:50,240 --> 00:34:56,560
i'm just saying there are forces unleashed\h
in terms of getting people information that\h\h

341
00:34:57,200 --> 00:35:04,000
never were unleashed during the 40s 50s and\h
60s so what were the key events in 1947 that\h\h

342
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:09,680
you think our audience need to know about well\h
i i i think the kenneth arnold case is what\h\h

343
00:35:09,680 --> 00:35:15,040
everybody says kicked it off all right and you\h
know we don't have time to tell the whole kenneth\h\h

344
00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:20,080
arnold story but it's a pretty good case he was a\h
credible pilot he had like nine thousand hours of\h\h

345
00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:27,040
flying time and uh he he did a really good report\h
but people think well that was the starters pistol\h\h

346
00:35:27,040 --> 00:35:32,080
but the truth is there were a number of things\h
that were being reported prior to kenneth arnold\h\h

347
00:35:32,080 --> 00:35:37,520
kenneth arnold's story goes public and then what\h
happens is a lot of those people who had seen\h\h

348
00:35:37,520 --> 00:35:44,560
things and there were many chose to come forward\h
and tell people about what what they had seen and\h\h

349
00:35:44,560 --> 00:35:50,240
you know instead of talking about kenneth arnold\h
ross because um you know again there's lots of\h\h

350
00:35:50,240 --> 00:35:55,120
information you can go read the wikipedia page on\h
him read my article in the debrief i mean there's\h\h

351
00:35:55,120 --> 00:36:00,240
a lot about kenneth arnold in it i want to focus\h
on a case that's a little more interesting to me\h\h

352
00:36:00,240 --> 00:36:08,160
um and you mentioned about pilot cases and and and\h
airlines okay when kenneth arnold reported what he\h\h

353
00:36:08,160 --> 00:36:16,480
saw there was a pilot a united airlines pilot\h
um a fellow named captain smith captain emel j\h\h

354
00:36:16,480 --> 00:36:22,480
smith and he basically said you know i've he\h
was asked by the media and he said i've never\h\h

355
00:36:22,480 --> 00:36:27,840
seen anything like arnold's flying saucers and the\h
other pilots say they haven't either and what that\h\h

356
00:36:27,840 --> 00:36:33,360
other fellow arnold probably saw was a reflection\h
of his own instrument panel so basically this guy\h\h

357
00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:37,440
was saying don't believe arnold he doesn't know\h
what he's talking about this stuff doesn't happen\h\h

358
00:36:37,440 --> 00:36:44,960
well okay one week later one week after arnold's\h
thing or 11 days this guy captain smith is off\h\h

359
00:36:44,960 --> 00:36:51,680
in united airlines number 105. he's eight minutes\h
into his flight in clear weather and they saw five\h\h

360
00:36:51,680 --> 00:36:58,000
disc-like objects heading straight for their dc3\h
and smith and his co-pilot ralph stevens observe\h\h

361
00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:03,600
the object's reverse direction and take up a\h
course literally parallel with their own they were\h\h

362
00:37:03,600 --> 00:37:11,040
able to see them clearly and when those took off a\h
second group came and followed them and uh so this\h\h

363
00:37:11,040 --> 00:37:16,720
guy became went from being a skeptical uh person\h
about what arnold had said to having had his own\h\h

364
00:37:16,720 --> 00:37:23,520
pretty incredible sighting and this was uh one of\h
the very first airline sightings it's been hugely\h\h

365
00:37:23,520 --> 00:37:28,880
underreported and i think it's just a powerful\h
powerful case because you know these guys weren't\h\h

366
00:37:28,880 --> 00:37:34,800
making it up you know one of the things when you\h
use that term the summer of the sources it really\h\h

367
00:37:34,800 --> 00:37:42,080
was i mean all through there was clearly anomalous\h
phenomena all over the united states and i i\h\h

368
00:37:42,080 --> 00:37:47,040
didn't realize until i started combing newspaper\h
reports and reading the history books of that era\h\h

369
00:37:47,680 --> 00:37:54,480
there were a plethora of sightings it was an\h
amazing flock of ufos seen right across the united\h\h

370
00:37:54,480 --> 00:38:00,640
states what was going on with the nuclear testing\h
at the time were they testing weaponry in the\h\h

371
00:38:00,640 --> 00:38:05,760
nevada test range at that period well let's face\h
it well actually new mexico was kind of the hot\h\h

372
00:38:05,760 --> 00:38:12,480
seat of nuclear um research and so forth so that\h
would explain roswell the only nuclear bomber base\h\h

373
00:38:12,480 --> 00:38:17,840
in the in the world um yeah a lot of stuff was\h
going down in the summer of 47 and there were\h\h

374
00:38:17,840 --> 00:38:21,920
hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of sightings\h
and they're really good and one thing i wanted\h\h

375
00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:27,360
to point out for people is on our website need to\h
know dot today so again that's need to know spell\h\h

376
00:38:27,360 --> 00:38:34,160
it out dot today you can download the report\h
on 1947 that was written by a man named ted\h\h

377
00:38:34,160 --> 00:38:40,560
blecker and did a great job of it and in that\h
to answer you know what you were saying ross\h\h

378
00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:48,800
these various reports there's hundreds of them\h
and many of them look parallel to what we've\h\h

379
00:38:48,800 --> 00:38:55,840
been reporting today there's even things that\h
sound like a tic tac uh there's there's sightings\h\h

380
00:38:55,840 --> 00:39:03,360
of landings there's i mean and at the time because\h
it was so crazy people in 1947 were like whoa that\h\h

381
00:39:03,360 --> 00:39:08,640
can't be and so what happened is a lot of that got\h
dismissed but now knowing what we know including\h\h

382
00:39:08,640 --> 00:39:13,520
the fact the government has said it's real and\h
now you go read these cases again it's a powerful\h\h

383
00:39:13,520 --> 00:39:18,160
thing i urge people to download that document\h
and read it and it'll it'll blow some minds\h\h

384
00:39:19,440 --> 00:39:27,760
now speaking of tic tacs i think when we come back\h
we need to come back to this issue of drones uas's\h\h

385
00:39:27,760 --> 00:39:36,400
unidentified aerial systems um i'm sorry unmanned\h
aerial systems because i think we need to address\h\h

386
00:39:36,400 --> 00:39:43,520
a looming counter explanation that's coming up\h
in ufology that the claim that whatever this\h\h

387
00:39:43,520 --> 00:39:55,840
phenomena is it's going to be plausibly explained\h
as drones coming back shortly on need to know\h\h

388
00:40:08,640 --> 00:40:14,960
welcome back to need to know i'm ross coulthart\h
and my co-host bryce sable is with me now we\h\h

389
00:40:14,960 --> 00:40:21,760
were talking earlier about the summer of the\h
sources 1947 which was very much the year that\h\h

390
00:40:21,760 --> 00:40:28,240
kicked off the ufo era now bryce one of the\h
questions i want to ask you my friend is do\h\h

391
00:40:28,240 --> 00:40:36,880
you buy into the conspiracy theory that 1947 saw\h
the formation of the central intelligence agency\h\h

392
00:40:36,880 --> 00:40:41,600
and the u.s air force said it only it had\h
only been part of the army during world war\h\h

393
00:40:41,600 --> 00:40:47,840
ii and the conspiracy theory has it that the\h
formation of both of these agencies came about\h\h

394
00:40:47,840 --> 00:40:54,640
as a result of the momentous discovery of alleged\h
extraterrestrial civilizations visiting our planet\h\h

395
00:40:54,640 --> 00:41:01,760
in 1947. do you give that credence no i don't i\h
think we can dismiss that one pretty much out of\h\h

396
00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:08,080
hand just by looking at the calendar but to set\h
up what you said the national security act uh was\h\h

397
00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:15,280
proposed in 1947 and passed in 1947 and that\h
act among many things that it did is it took\h\h

398
00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:21,840
the army air force which was you know the the air\h
force during world war ii but it gave it its own\h\h

399
00:41:21,840 --> 00:41:27,200
specific branch of the service and it also created\h
the cia but here's the interesting thing they were\h\h

400
00:41:27,200 --> 00:41:34,400
talking about doing things like that in 1946 and\h
also um the the cia had a precursor the central\h\h

401
00:41:34,400 --> 00:41:40,240
intelligence group and of course the air force\h
had a precursor um you know the army air force\h\h

402
00:41:40,240 --> 00:41:48,960
uh and and and they i believe um were signed into\h
law in july and became law in september so there\h\h

403
00:41:48,960 --> 00:41:55,040
really was no time to try to dump uh roswell or\h
any other summer of the saucer stuff onto them it\h\h

404
00:41:55,040 --> 00:42:00,640
was uh just a a moment but now what's interesting\h
is both the air force and the central intelligence\h\h

405
00:42:00,640 --> 00:42:07,840
agency went on to have very large roles in trying\h
to uh delve into the truth behind the saucer\h\h

406
00:42:07,840 --> 00:42:13,440
situation so come on let's be nasty about it they\h
had a huge role particularly the both of them\h\h

407
00:42:14,160 --> 00:42:18,000
in trying to cover up the whole bloody things\h
well they certainly did and you know i think we\h\h

408
00:42:18,000 --> 00:42:25,760
should actually do the cia for an entire episode\h
coming up but just to you know put a bow on 1947.\h\h

409
00:42:25,760 --> 00:42:32,720
so um three days before the summer of the saucers\h
ended i believe the um the national security act\h\h

410
00:42:33,520 --> 00:42:37,280
takes over and then right after it\h
at the same time there was a memo\h\h

411
00:42:37,920 --> 00:42:44,320
going around inside the pentagon and it ended up\h
being put together by a lieutenant general nathan\h\h

412
00:42:44,320 --> 00:42:50,880
twining and uh it became very famous because it\h
was as i said it was not circulated to the public\h\h

413
00:42:50,880 --> 00:42:55,840
they never saw anything like this and it really\h
didn't get circulated widely even in the pentagon\h\h

414
00:42:55,840 --> 00:43:01,120
because there was a lot of security around it but\h
what twining wrote in his memo is is it's a it's\h\h

415
00:43:01,120 --> 00:43:06,960
a barn burner not only for its time but for all\h
time he said and this is the famous part he said\h\h

416
00:43:06,960 --> 00:43:13,200
it is the opinion that the phenomenon is\h
something real and not visionary or fictitious\h\h

417
00:43:13,200 --> 00:43:20,000
okay so he was acknowledging in 1947 what our own\h
government really hasn't acknowledged until 2021\h\h

418
00:43:20,000 --> 00:43:25,040
all right and in further clear language\h
this is what he said the reported operating\h\h

419
00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:31,360
characteristics such as extreme rates of climb\h
maneuverability particularly enroll and action\h\h

420
00:43:31,360 --> 00:43:37,280
which must be considered evasive when cited lend\h
belief to the possibility that some of the objects\h\h

421
00:43:37,280 --> 00:43:43,600
are controlled either manually automatically or\h
remotely which by the way if they're remotely\h\h

422
00:43:43,600 --> 00:43:48,480
controlled ross i think that brings us to what\h
you said we're going to talk about here which\h\h

423
00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:54,800
is drones i mean to the best of my knowledge in\h
1947 the united states government the chinese\h\h

424
00:43:54,800 --> 00:44:01,840
government the uh the russian soviet union\h
government did not have drones that had those\h\h

425
00:44:01,840 --> 00:44:07,040
characteristics so even if there are drones\h
flying around today that are pretty advanced\h\h

426
00:44:07,680 --> 00:44:13,520
i'm not sure i'm making the connection here\h
well it puts paid to the idea that there was\h\h

427
00:44:13,520 --> 00:44:19,840
some private aerospace company that's developed\h
these drones today that uh possibly how could\h\h

428
00:44:19,840 --> 00:44:24,320
they possibly have had them 75 years ago i\h
mean the reality is that if the phenomenon\h\h

429
00:44:24,320 --> 00:44:33,040
was manifesting itself 75 years ago it's been\h
here for three quarters of a century so this\h\h

430
00:44:33,040 --> 00:44:39,040
notion that there's just been this very recent\h
discovery of this phenomenon is patently absurd\h\h

431
00:44:39,040 --> 00:44:44,880
and i guess that's why i wanted to come to that\h
those words that came out of the mods of mr schiff\h\h

432
00:44:46,240 --> 00:44:53,440
in the hearings before the congress\h
congressman schiff asked the question\h\h

433
00:44:54,000 --> 00:45:00,320
in relation to the second two videos that were\h
shown the the ones that showed triangles and\h\h

434
00:45:00,320 --> 00:45:06,560
he asked if scott bray the director of naval\h
intelligence quote the hypothesis is those are\h\h

435
00:45:06,560 --> 00:45:12,400
commercial drones and that because of the use of\h
night vision goggles they appear like triangles is\h\h

436
00:45:12,400 --> 00:45:17,440
that the operating assessment and clearly i think\h
mr schiffer had some information that this is what\h\h

437
00:45:17,440 --> 00:45:24,320
the navy wanted to say and mr bray went yes some\h
type of drone some type of unmanned aerial system\h\h

438
00:45:24,320 --> 00:45:28,800
and it's simply that that light source resolves\h
itself through the night vision goggles onto the\h\h

439
00:45:28,800 --> 00:45:34,800
slr camera as a triangle and that's called bokeh\h
now it's an open question frankly bryce whether or\h\h

440
00:45:34,800 --> 00:45:41,440
not there is um a triangle that was filmed over\h
a ship but it is starting to look like at least\h\h

441
00:45:41,440 --> 00:45:49,360
some of these objects that have been filmed off\h
u.s navy vessels are indeed drones of some kind\h\h

442
00:45:49,360 --> 00:45:54,720
and indeed in the report that was published by our\h
colleagues from the the war zone which is part of\h\h

443
00:45:54,720 --> 00:46:01,920
thedrive.com uh there was indeed a picture of an\h
object that looked faintly like a quadcopter drone\h\h

444
00:46:02,560 --> 00:46:07,200
and i'm a little bit worried that in all the\h
evidence that was tended a month ago before the\h\h

445
00:46:07,200 --> 00:46:12,640
congress we saw a very blurry opaque image\h
of a spherical object zooming past a plane\h\h

446
00:46:13,200 --> 00:46:18,720
now we're being fed this line that these are\h
drones and it ignores our history it ignores\h\h

447
00:46:18,720 --> 00:46:24,560
the fact that twining general nathan twining\h
75 years ago was talking about the possibility\h\h

448
00:46:24,560 --> 00:46:32,480
of unmanned aerial systems 75 years ago they were\h
that there were remote controlled unmanned objects\h\h

449
00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:38,720
operating in our skies even back then in the best\h
opinion as a possibility of the the us air force\h\h

450
00:46:39,600 --> 00:46:46,240
so i think that's why we need to remember this\h
history and yes i i just want to address the\h\h

451
00:46:46,240 --> 00:46:54,400
drones issue because um there are as well as\h
the navy vessels because i've i've got to be\h\h

452
00:46:54,400 --> 00:46:59,040
careful here because i have to protect sources\h
i've had the privilege in the last few weeks of\h\h

453
00:46:59,040 --> 00:47:05,440
speaking to people who've been on some of these\h
navy ships which is why i've been pushing it a\h\h

454
00:47:05,440 --> 00:47:12,000
little bit on social media they agree that yes\h
in some of these engagements there have been\h\h

455
00:47:12,000 --> 00:47:18,080
what were probably drones perhaps not commercial\h
drones but maybe military drones of some kind\h\h

456
00:47:18,880 --> 00:47:25,600
but in some of the videos you see objects doing\h
anomalous things and some of those people have\h\h

457
00:47:25,600 --> 00:47:30,960
actually seen this with their own eyeballs and\h
they're saying these weren't drones these weren't\h\h

458
00:47:30,960 --> 00:47:36,240
things that that we can equate with a modern\h
drone system the movements were too erratic\h\h

459
00:47:36,960 --> 00:47:44,240
the the the the velocity the acceleration was\h
too rapid and i think we need to remember this\h\h

460
00:47:44,240 --> 00:47:50,080
and we need to also link back with the fact that\h
there are a series of unsolved mysteries with\h\h

461
00:47:50,080 --> 00:47:59,200
drones that that the drones explanation doesn't\h
cover satisfactorily remember that 2020 2021\h\h

462
00:47:59,760 --> 00:48:07,440
all over the midwest of of the united states there\h
were warnings there were warnings that there were\h\h

463
00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:13,360
drone swarms hovering over communities\h
right across colorado and the midwest\h\h

464
00:48:14,480 --> 00:48:21,760
that was never explained that mystery has never to\h
this day been explained police officers military\h\h

465
00:48:21,760 --> 00:48:28,480
fbi i've spoken to some of these people what they\h
saw were not drones but again for some perverse\h\h

466
00:48:28,480 --> 00:48:35,040
reason the explanation is being used that these\h
are drones and i just cautioned because whilst\h\h

467
00:48:35,040 --> 00:48:41,920
i accept that yes indeed there are probably some\h
commercial or military drones that are appearing\h\h

468
00:48:41,920 --> 00:48:48,560
from potable foreign adversaries maybe china over\h
some of these navy vessels it doesn't explain the\h\h

469
00:48:48,560 --> 00:48:54,640
phenomenon that has been widely seen including\h
right back in 1981 by the guy who wrote to me from\h\h

470
00:48:54,640 --> 00:49:02,080
the uss eisenhower who saw an equilateral triangle\h
a massive triangle with lights in each corner\h\h

471
00:49:02,080 --> 00:49:10,240
hovering over the cruiser adjacent to the aircraft\h
carrier navy people are seeing to this day\h\h

472
00:49:10,240 --> 00:49:16,800
and have been seeing right through those\h
75 years back to world war ii back to 1947\h\h

473
00:49:18,240 --> 00:49:23,520
they have been seeing anomalous phenomena over\h
their ships especially nuclear-powered ships\h\h

474
00:49:24,080 --> 00:49:29,040
and that's what the congress needs to get its\h
teeth into that's what it needs to investigate\h\h

475
00:49:29,680 --> 00:49:33,840
and before i finish my little rant price the\h
other thing i wanted to point to was another\h\h

476
00:49:33,840 --> 00:49:41,280
unsolved mystery the drones that were seen over\h
gatwick airport a couple of years ago in london\h\h

477
00:49:41,280 --> 00:49:48,880
they closed one of britain's busiest airports\h
for two days a massive disruption to travel\h\h

478
00:49:48,880 --> 00:49:55,360
at a really critical time of the year and\h
again i've had the privilege of speaking to\h\h

479
00:49:55,360 --> 00:50:02,400
one person who saw the alleged drones and\h
they say what they saw was not a drone\h\h

480
00:50:03,040 --> 00:50:09,520
so why is it that officialdom is now using even an\h
evidence to the congress why are they starting to\h\h

481
00:50:09,520 --> 00:50:19,200
use this semantic term that makes the mysterious\h
sound prosaic well there's a couple answers to\h\h

482
00:50:19,200 --> 00:50:26,960
that one is uh they're trying to turn drones\h
into the swamp gas of 2022 the the explanation\h\h

483
00:50:26,960 --> 00:50:31,680
that you can sort of say well that's what's really\h
going on i just want to make one thing clear ross\h\h

484
00:50:31,680 --> 00:50:36,640
because you did that was a great that was not even\h
a rant that was a measured explanation of drones\h\h

485
00:50:37,200 --> 00:50:42,000
nobody is saying that there aren't drones\h
everywhere right now and nobody is saying\h\h

486
00:50:42,000 --> 00:50:49,680
that there aren't super advanced drones but what\h
we are saying is uh there seems to be a phenomenon\h\h

487
00:50:49,680 --> 00:50:55,760
that doesn't have that has a capability beyond\h
anything that we think any drone could do today\h\h

488
00:50:55,760 --> 00:51:04,400
let alone back in 1947 or in the 50s or the 60s or\h
or the 70s my take by the way on why we're hearing\h\h

489
00:51:04,400 --> 00:51:11,440
a lot about drones is it it is kind of the last\h
gasps of covering up uh what's going on which is\h\h

490
00:51:11,440 --> 00:51:17,440
uh you know first there was well we we don't think\h
the us makes them but uh you know maybe china or\h\h

491
00:51:17,440 --> 00:51:23,120
russia and that's sort of the in the cover the\h
the fig leaf that uh congress people are able\h\h

492
00:51:23,120 --> 00:51:30,640
to use to to ask uh questions about uh what our\h
uap which they think are more exotic but it gives\h\h

493
00:51:30,640 --> 00:51:35,600
them a little cover so that's going on that's\h
probably what's uh driving the whole drone thing\h\h

494
00:51:35,600 --> 00:51:40,960
um listen i know we got to get out of here um and\h
it's it's you know every time we do one of these\h\h

495
00:51:40,960 --> 00:51:47,920
costs i go wow i wish we had an hour and a half\h
on the last five seconds we just talked about\h\h

496
00:51:47,920 --> 00:51:53,360
but you know that's why i guess we do these with\h
regularity i just wanted to remind people again\h\h

497
00:51:53,360 --> 00:52:00,080
um if they want to read about 1947 that article\h
is on our website need to know dot today and\h\h

498
00:52:00,080 --> 00:52:06,160
you can download it uh the article that i wrote\h
about 1947 is on the debrief and i think it'll\h\h

499
00:52:06,160 --> 00:52:12,240
be out there tomorrow and um and ross if you'll\h
forgive me i'm going to give you the last word but\h\h

500
00:52:12,240 --> 00:52:19,280
you know and i know understand your your issues\h
with bob dylan and uh and all that but the song\h\h

501
00:52:19,280 --> 00:52:24,880
that he's going to end with tomorrow night it's\h
on his list is a song called every grain of sand i\h\h

502
00:52:24,880 --> 00:52:30,400
think he wrote it back in 1981 and i just want to\h
read the final you know some of the words from it\h\h

503
00:52:30,400 --> 00:52:36,800
and think about the cover-up he said don't have\h
the inclination to look back on any mistake like\h\h

504
00:52:36,800 --> 00:52:43,440
kane i now behold this chain of events that i must\h
break of the flowers of indulgence and the weeds\h\h

505
00:52:43,440 --> 00:52:49,840
of yesteryear like criminals they have choked\h
the breadth of conscience and good cheer which\h\h

506
00:52:49,840 --> 00:52:54,400
is pretty much how i feel about people who won't\h
share their work and show us the good pictures\h\h

507
00:52:54,400 --> 00:53:01,600
and the good videos well hopefully my friend those\h
possible criminals are going to be dragged kicking\h\h

508
00:53:01,600 --> 00:53:09,360
and screaming into the congress someday soon and\h
asked to uh to explain themselves we can but hope\h\h

509
00:53:10,000 --> 00:53:15,520
but that's for another episode of need\h
to know it's been great talking to you\h\h